JURI Committee Meeting

Meeting No. 47

MINUTES OF PROCEEDING

THURSDAY, March 26, 1998

The Standing Committee on Justice and Human Rights met at 9:23 o’clock a.m., this day, in room 371 West Block, the Chair, Shaughnessy Cohen, presiding.

Members of the Committee present: Shaughnessy Cohen, Paul DeVillers, Nick Discepola, Derek Lee, Peter G. MacKay, John Maloney, Richard Marceau and Jack Ramsay.

Acting Members present: Denis Coderrre for Sheila Finestone, Paul Bonwick for Sheila Finestone, Murray Calder for Andrew Telegdi, Julian Reed for Eleni Bakopanos, Chuck Cadman for Garry Breitkreuz, Val Meredith for Paul E. Forseth, Marlene Jennings for Eleni Bakopanos, Christiane Gagnon for Richard Marceau.

In attendance: From the Parliamentary Research Branch: Philip Rosen, Senior Analyst and Marilyn Pilon, Research Officer. From Committees and Legislative Services Directorate: Monique Hamilton, Suzanne Verville, Legislative Clerks.

Witnesses: From the Department of the Solicitor General of Canada: Marian Harymann, Senior Policy Analyst, Corrections Branch; Paul Dubrule, Director, Legal Services. From the Department of Justice: Michael Zigayer, Senior Counsel, Criminal Law Policy Section; Michael Pierce, Counsel, Human Rights Law Section.

Pursuant to its order of reference of November 4, 1997, the Committee continued its consideration of Bill C-3, An Act respecting DNA identification and to make consequential amendments to the Criminal Code and other Acts (See Minutes of Proceedings dated Wednesday, February 4, 1998, meeting No. 23).

The Committee proceeded to the clause by clause consideration.

The consideration of Clause 1 is postponed pursuant to Standing Order 75(1).

Clause 2 to 4 carried severally.

By unanimous consent, Clause 5 was allowed to stand.

On Clause 6

Richard Marceau moved, --That Bill C-3, in Clause 6, be amended

a) by replacing line 17 on page 4 with the following:

"convicted offenders index to the government of a "

b) by adding after line 21 on page 4 the following:

" (4.1) Notwithstanding subsection (4), the Commissioner shall not communicate a DNA profile to the government of a foreign state, an international organization established by the governments of states or an institution of any such government or international organization unless the government, organization or institution has entered into an agreement or a bilateral or multilateral agreement with the Government of Canada requiring it to treat the genetic information obtained from Canada in the same way as it is treated in Canada."

After debate, the question being put on the amendment, it was negatived, on the following recorded division:

 

YEAS: Chuck Cadman NAYS: Murray Calder

Peter G. MacKay Paul DeVillers

Richard Marceau Nick Discepola

Val Meredith Derek Lee

Jack Ramsay (5) John Maloney

John McKay (6)

Clause 6 carried on division.

Clause 7 and 8 carried.

On New Clause 8.1

John Maloney moved, -- That Bill C-3 be amended by adding after line 6 on page 5 the following:

"8.1 Access to the information in the crime scene index shall be permanently removed, in accordance with any regulations that may be made under this Act, if the information relates to a DNA profile derived from bodily substance of

1. a victim of a designated offence that was the object of the relevant investigation; or
2. a person who has been eliminated as a suspect in the relevant investigation."

After debate, the question being put on new clause 8.1, it was agreed to on division.

On Clause 9

John Maloney moved, -- That Bill C-3, in Clause 9, be amended by replacing lines 11 and 12 on page 5 with the following:

" (2) Access to the following information in the convicted offenders index shall be permanently removed without"

After debate, the question being put on the amendment, it was agreed to.

Jack Ramsay moved, -- That Bill C-3, in Clause 9, be amended by replacing line 26 on page 5 with the following:

"(ii) the expiry of five years after the"

After debate, the question being put on the amendment, it was negatived.

Peter G. MacKay moved, -- That Bill C-3, in Clause 9, be amended by adding after line 22 on page 6 the following:

" (3) Notwithstanding paragraphs (2)(c), (d), or (e) information in the convicted offenders index shall be kept indefinitely

1. in the case of information in relation to a young person designated in paragraph (2)(c), where the young person is convicted of an indictable offence prior to the expiry of the ten years referred to it in that paragraph
2. in the case of an information in relation to a young person described in paragraph (2)(d), where the young person is convicted of an indictable offence prior to the expiry of the five years referred to it that paragraph;
3. in the case of information in relation to a young person described in paragraph (2)(e), where the young person is convicted of an indictable offence prior to the expiry of the three years referred to it that paragraph."

After debate, the question being put on the amendment, it was negatived.

Clause 9, as amended, carried on division.

On Clause 10

Jack Ramsay moved, -- That Bill C-3, in Clause 10, be amended by replacing line 28 on page 7 with the following:

"(ii) after the expiry of five years after the"

After debate, the question being put on the amendment, it was negatived.

Clause 10 carried on division.

Clause 11 carried.

Clause 12 carried on division

Clause 13 and 14 carried.

On Clause 15

Paul DeVillers moved, -- That Bill C-3, in Clause 15, be amended by replacing line 2 on page 11 with the following:

"487.055 or 487.091, or a bodily substance referred to in paragraph 487.05 (1) (b), means forensic"

After debate, the question being put on the amendment, it was agreed to.

Jack Ramsay, moved, -- That Bill C-3, in Clause 15, be amended by adding after line 14 on page 11 the following:

" (v) section 159 (anal intercourse),

(vi) subsection 160(3) (bestiality in the presence of or by a child),

(vii) section 163.1 (pornography),

(viii) section 170 (parent or guardian procuring sexual activity),

(ix) section 172 (corrupting children),

(x) section 173 (indecent acts),"

After debate, Peter G. MacKay moved the following sub-amendment, – That the amendment be amended by:

1. replacing the words "line 14 on page 11" by the following: "line 23 on page 12"; and

b) deleting subparagraphs (v) and (ix)

After debate, the sub-amendment was agreed to on the following recorded division:

YEAS: Chuck Cadman NAYS: Eleni Bakopanos

Derek Lee Denis Coderre

Peter MacKay Paul De Villers

John Maloney Nick Discepola (4)

Richard Marceau

Val Meredith

John McKay

Jack Ramsay

Andrew Telegdi (9)

The Committee resumed consideration of the amendment as amended, --

"That Bill C-3, in Clause 15, be amended by adding after line 23 on page 12 the following

(v) subsection 160(3) (bestiality in the presence of or by a child),

(vi) section 163.1 (pornography),

(vii) section 170 (parent or guardian procuring sexual activity),

(viii) section 173 (indecent acts),"

The question being put on the amendment, as amended, it was agreed to on the following recorded division:

YEAS: Chuck Cadman NAYS: Eleni Bakopanos

Derek Lee Denis Coderre

Peter MacKay Paul DeVillers

John Maloney Nick Discepola

Richard Marceau John McKay (5)

Val Meredith

Jack Ramsay

Andrew Telegdi (8)

Jack Ramsay moved, -- That Bill C-3, in Clause 15, be amended by adding after line 16 on page 11 the following:

"(vi) section 233 (infanticide),"

After debate, the question being put on the amendment, it was agreed to.

Jack Ramsay moved, -- That Bill C-3, in Clause 15, be amended by:

a) adding after line 27 on page 12 the following:

"(ix) subsection 249(3) (dangerous operation causing bodily harm),

(x) subsection 249(4) (dangerous operation causing death);"

b) adding after line 29 on page 12 the following:

"(xi) subsection 255(2) (impaired driving causing bodily harm),

(xii) subsection 255(3) (impaired driving causing death),"

After debate, the question being put on the amendment, it was agreed to.

Jack Ramsay moved, -- That Bill C-3, in Clause 15, be amended by replacing lines 31 and 32 on page 11 with the following:

"assault),

(xv) section 279 (kidnapping), and

(xvi) section 346 (extortion)"

After debate, by unanimous consent, Jack Ramsay was allowed to withdraw his amendment.

Clause 15, as amended, carried.

On Clause 16

Jack Ramsay moved, -- That Bill C-3, in Clause 16, be amended by replacing line 24 on page 13 with the following:

"(b) that a bodily substance has been found or obtained"

After debate, the question being put on the amendment, it was agreed to.

By unanimous consent, Clause 16, as amended, was allowed to stand.

On Clause 17

Jack Ramsay moved, -- That Bill C-3, in Clause 17, be amended by replacing lines 27 and 28 on page 14 with the following:

" 487.051 (1) If a person is charged, discharged under section"

After debate, the question being put on the amendment, it was negatived on the following recorded division:

YEAS: Chuck Cadman NAYS: Eleni Bakopanos

Paul E. Forseth Denis Coderre

Peter G. MacKay Paul DeVillers

Jack Ramsay (4) Nick Discepola

Derek Lee

John Maloney

Richard Marceau

John McKay

Andrew Telegdi (9)

By unanimous consent, the Committee agreed not to consider the amendments to Clause 17 according to the usual line by line order.

Richard Marceau moved, -- That Bill C-3, in Clause 17, be amended by

1. replacing lines 13 to 20 on page 19 with the following:

" (3) Samples of bodily substances referred to in sections 487.051, 487.052 and 487.055 shall be taken by a health professional trained to take samples of bodily substances by means of the investigative procedures described in subsections 487.06(1)."

2. replacing line 22 on page 19 with the following:

"rized to cause to be taken under the"

3. replacing lines 1 to 2 on page 20 with the following:

" 487.058 No health professional incurs."

After debate, the question being put on the amendment, it was negatived.

Jack Ramsay moved, -- That Bill C-3, in Clause 17, be amended by deleting lines 1 to 20 on page 15.

After debate, the question being put on the amendment, it was negatived.

Jack Ramsay moved, -- That Bill C-3, in Clause 17, be amended by replacing line 21 on page 15 with the following:

" 487.052 (1) If a"

By unanimous consent, Jack Ramsay was allowed to withdraw his amendment.

Jack Ramsay moved, -- That Bill C-3, in Clause 17, be amended by deleting lines 1 to 23 on page 16.

After debate, the question being put on the amendment, it was negatived.

Jack Ramsay moved, -- That Bill C-3, in Clause 17, be amended by replacing lines 31 to 40 on page 16 with the following:

"before the coming into force of this subsection, had beeen convicted of one or more primary designated offences and is, on the date of the application, serving a sentence of imprisonment of at least two years for one or more of these offences,"

After debate, the question being put on the amendment, it was negatived.

John Maloney moved, -- That Bill C-3, in Clause 17, be amended by

(a) replacing line 28 on page 16 with the following:

" 487.055 (1) A provincial court judge may, on ex parte"

(b) replacing lines 33 to 38 on page 16 with the following:

"offender under Part XXIV,

(b) before the coming into force of this subsection, had been convicted of more than one murder committed at different times, or

(c) before the coming into force of this subsection, had been convicted of more than one sexual offence within the meaning of subsection (3) and, on the date of the application, is serving a sentence"

(c) replacing lines 32 to 37 on page 19 with the following:

"the warrant or granted the authorization, or another judge of that provincial court; or

(b) the court that made the order."

After debate, the question being put on the amendment, it was agreed to.

At 12:54 o’clock p.m., the sitting was suspended.

At 1:02 o’clock p.m., the sitting resumed in public.

John Maloney moved, -- That Bill C-3, in Clause 17, be amended by adding after line 41 on page 17 the following:

"(3.1) In deciding whether to grant an authorization under subsection (1), the court shall consider the criminal record of the person, the nature of the offence and the circumstances surrounding its commission and the impact such an order would have on the person's privacy and security of the person and shall give reasons for its decision."

After debate, the question being put on the amendment, it was agreed to.

John Maloney moved, -- That Bill C-3, in Clause 17, be amended by replacing line 25 on page 16 with the following:

"appeal from a decision"

After debate, the question being put on the amendment, it was agreed to.

Peter G. MacKay moved, -- That Bill C-3, in Clause 17, be amended by replacing lines 19 and 20 on page 15 with the following:

"security of the person, on the public interest in the protection of society and on the proper administration of justice which is to be achieved through early detection, arrest and conviction of offenders. The court shall give reasons for its decision."

After debate, the question being put on the amendment, it was negatived.

Peter G. MacKay moved, -- That Bill C-3, in Clause 17 be amended by replacing lines 4 to 9 on page 16 with the following:

"advised by the person or young person, that they"

By unanimous consent, Peter G. MacKay was allowed to withdraw his amendment.

Peter G. MacKay moved, -- That Bill C-3, in Clause 17, be amended by replacing lines 1 to 41 on page 18 with the following:

" (4) For greater certainty, subsection 487.07(2) applies to a person referred to in subsection (1) who is conditional release."

After debate, the question being put on the amendment, it was negatived.

Clause 17, as amended, carried.

On Clause 18

John Maloney moved, -- That Bill C-3, in Clause 18, be amended by replacing lines 31 and 32 on page 20 with the following:

"provincial court judge or court, as the case may be, considers advisable"

After debate, the question being put on the amendment, it was agreed to.

Clause 18, as amended, carried.

On Clause 19

John Maloney moved, -- That Bill C-3, in Clause 19, be amended by:

(a) replacing line 11 on page 21 with the following:

"samples ;

(d.1) the possibility for the person to state their preference as to the bodily substance to be taken from the person; and"

(b) replacing lines 29 to 32 on page 21 with the following:

"the direction of a peace officer

1. shall ensure that the person’s privacy is respected in a manner that is reasonable in the circumstances; and
2. shall take the person’s preference into account as to the bodily substance to be taken before taking a bodily substance from the person."

After debate, the question being put on the amendment, it was agreed to.

Jack Ramsay moved, -- That Bill C-3, in Clause 19, be amended by adding after line 32 on page 21 the following:

" (4) The validity of using a bodily substance for the purposes of a forensic DNA analysis of that substance shall not be questioned on the ground that a peace officer failed to comply with any provision set out in subsection (1), provided the peace officer did so inadvertently."

After debate, the question being put on the amendment, it was negatived.

Clause 19, as amended, carried.

Clause 20 carried.

On Clause 21

Jack Ramsay moved, -- That Bill C-3, in Clause 21, be amended by replacing lines 35 to 42 on page 23 with the following:

"tion (1.1) or (2.1) is guilty of an indictable offence and liable to imprisonment for a term not exceeding two years."

After debate, the question being put on the amendment, it was negatived.

Clause 21 carried.

On Clause 22

John Maloney moved, -- That Bill C-3, in Clause 22, be amended by

a) replacing lines 1 to 6 on page 24 with the following:

"487.09 (1) Subject to subsection (2), bodily substances that are taken from a person in execution of a warrant under section 487.05 and the results of forensic DNA analysis shall be destroyed, or in the case of results in electronic form, access to those results shall be permanently removed, without delay after"

(b) replacing line 9 on page 24 with the following:

" (2) A pro-"

3. adding after line 21 on page 24 with the following:

" (3) Bodily substances that are provided voluntarily by a person, and the results of forensic DNA analysis shall be destroyed, or, in the case of results in electronic form, access to those results shall be permanently removed, without delay after the results of that analysis establish that the bodily substance referred to in paragraph 487.05 (1) (b) was not from that person."

After debate, the question being put on the amendment, it was agreed to.

Clause 22, as amended, carried.

On Clause 23

John Maloney moved, -- That Bill C-3, in Clause 23, be amended by replacing lines 22 and 23 on page 24 with the following:

"23. The Act is amended by renumbering section 487.091 as section 487.092 and by adding the following before the renumbered section 487.092: "

 

After debate, the question being put on the amendment, it was agreed to.

John Maloney moved, -- That Bill C-3, in Clause 23, be amended by replacing line 28 on page 24 with the following:

"authorization under section 487.055, a provincial court judge"

After debate, the question being put on the amendment, it was agreed to.

Clause 23, as amended, carried.

On Clause 24

John Maloney moved, -- That Bill C-3, in Clause 24, be amended by

(a) replacing lines 22 to 26 on page 30 with the following:

"XXIV of that Act,

 

(b) before subsection 487.055(1) of the Criminal Code came into force, had been convicted of more than one murder committed at different times, or

(c) before subsection 487.055(1) of the Criminal Code came into force, had been convicted of more than one sexual offence within the meaning of"

(b) adding after line 30 on page 30 the following:

"And whereas I have considered the offender's criminal record, the nature of the offence and the circumstances surrounding its commission and the impact that this authorization would have on the offender's privacy and security of the person;"

(c) replacing lines 27 to 31 on page 31 with the following:

"XXIV of that Act,

 

(b) before subsection 487.055(1) of the Criminal Code came into force, had been convicted of more than one murder committed at different times, or

(c) before subsection 487.055(1) of the Criminal Code came into force, had been convicted of more than one sexual offence within the meaning of"

(d) replacing line 1 on page 32 with the following:

"Whereas (name of peace officer), a peace"

(e) adding after line 8 on page 32 the following:

"And whereas I have considered the offender's criminal record, the nature of the offence and the circumstances surrounding its commission and the impact that this authorization would have on the offender's privacy and security of the person;"

(f) replacing line 28 on page 32 with the following:

"(Signature of provincial court judge)"

(g) replacing lines 1 to 15 and the headings before line 1 on page 33 with the following:

"FORM 5.07

(Subsection 487.057(1))

REPORT TO A PROVINCIAL COURT JUDGE OR THE COURT

Canada,

Province of ................,

(territorial division)

[    ]   To (name of judge), a judge of the provincial court who issued a warrant under section 487.05 or granted an authorization under section 487.055 or 487.091 of the Criminal Code or to another judge of that court:

[    ]   To the court from which an order under section 487.051 or 487.052 of the Criminal Code was made:"

(h) replacing lines 29 to 33 on page 33 with the following:

"under the warrant issued or an authorization granted by the judge or another judge of the court or an order made by the court)."

(i) replacing line 42 on page 36 with the following:

"(Signature of provincial court judge)"

After debate, the question being put on the amendment, it was agreed to.

Clause 24, as amended, carried.

Clause 25 and 26 carried.

Clause 5 carried.

Clause 16, as amended, carried.

The title carried.

The Bill, as amended, carried.

ORDERED, -- That the Chair report Bill C-3, with amendments, to the House.

ORDERED, -- That Bill C-3, An An Act respecting DNA identification and to make consequential amendments to the Criminal Code and other Acts be reprinted for the use of the House of Commons at the Report Stage.

At 2:00 o’clock p.m., the Committee adjourned to the call of the Chair.

 

 

 

Luc Fortin

Clerk of the Committee