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PACP Committee Meeting

Notices of Meeting include information about the subject matter to be examined by the committee and date, time and place of the meeting, as well as a list of any witnesses scheduled to appear. The Evidence is the edited and revised transcript of what is said before a committee. The Minutes of Proceedings are the official record of the business conducted by the committee at a sitting.

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Minutes of Proceedings

44th Parliament, 1st Session
Meeting 92
Thursday, December 14, 2023, 11:00 a.m. to 2:03 p.m.
Televised
Presiding
John Williamson, Chair (Conservative)

• Laila Goodridge for John Nater (Conservative)
• Tracy Gray for Jake Stewart (Conservative)
• Francis Drouin (Liberal)
• Branden Leslie (Conservative)
House of Commons
• Carine Grand-Jean, Procedural Clerk
 
Library of Parliament
• Mahdi Benmoussa, Analyst
• Lindsay McGlashan, Analyst
• Dillan Theckedath, Analyst
Department of Employment and Social Development
• Paul Thompson, Deputy Minister
• Cliff Groen, Associate Deputy Minister and Business Lead, Benefits Delivery Modernization
• John Ostrander, Technical Lead, Benefits Delivery Modernization
Department of Public Works and Government Services
• Arianne Reza, Deputy Minister
• Mollie Royds, Associate Assistant Deputy Minister, Procurement Branch
Office of the Auditor General
• Andrew Hayes, Deputy Auditor General
• Patrice Malboeuf, Director
• Jocelyn Matthews, Director
Shared Services Canada
• Scott Jones, President
• Shannon Archibald, Assistant Deputy Minister, Hosting Services
• Scott Davis, Chief Financial Officer
Treasury Board Secretariat
• Catherine Luelo, Deputy Minister and Chief Information Officer of Canada
Pursuant to Standing Order 108(3)(g), the committee commenced consideration of the Government of Canada Information Technology Systems, referred to the committee on Thursday, October 19, 2023.

The witnesses made statements and answered questions.

At 12:52 p.m., the sitting was suspended.

At 12:59 p.m., the sitting resumed in camera.

The committee proceeded to the consideration of matters related to committee business.

It was agreed, — That the Standing Committee on Public Accounts, recommends that the Government of Canada, and specifically, the President of the Treasury Board, review the work of the Canadian Audit and Accountability and take steps to provide adequate and stable funding for the capacity-building program as part of legislative oversight bodies.

It was agreed, — That the committee proceed to sit in public.

At 1:16 p.m., the sitting was suspended.

At 1:20 p.m., the sitting resumed in public.

Motion

Brenda Shanahan moved, —

Whereas, the Alberta Energy Regulator failed to contain a tailing pond seepage while waiting 7 months for a geochemistry study to be completed.

Whereas, the Alberta Energy Regulator previously claimed that there was no contaminants found in the waterways when in fact Imperial staff told ACFN inspectors that dissolved iron was found in waterbody 3, and on April 3, 2023 that a test showed F2 hydrocarbons and naphthenic acids in waterbody.

That the committee express its disappointment with the Alberta Energy Regulator and acknowledge that the Alberta Energy Regulator has been deficient in protecting the environment and health of communities adjacent to tailing ponds that it regulates.

That, in relation to the Follow-up Study on Report 3, Access to Safe Drinking Water in First Nations Communities – Indigenous Services Canada, of the 2021 Reports 1 to 5 of the Auditor General of Canada, and following the evidence provided by witnesses at the Standing Committee on Environment and Sustainable Development regarding the toxic leak of tailing ponds and ongoing deficiencies in protecting the health and safety of Indigenous communities at risk, the committee:

1. Call on the Alberta Energy Regulator and the Government of Alberta work with companies that operate tailing ponds and the federal government to conduct a study to assess the impacts of tailing ponds on human health;

2. Call on the Alberta Energy Regulator to require operators of tailing ponds to increase monitoring of adjacent drinking water sources;

3. Call on the Alberta Energy Regulator to conduct a geotechnical audit of all tailings limits;

4. Call on the Alberta Energy Regulator to require operators of tailing ponds to halt the release of tailings into waterways; and

5. Request that the Office of the Auditor General, through the Commissioner of the Environment and Sustainable Development, conduct an audit of environmental protections around Canada’s waterbodies, especially those on Indigenous lands.

The Chair ruled the motion inadmissible because it was beyond the committee’s mandate, as provided on page 1065 of House of Commons Procedure and Practice, Third Edition.

Where upon, Iqra Khalid appealed of the decision of the Chair.

The question: “Shall the decision of the Chair be sustained?” was put and the decision was overturned, by the following recorded division: YEAS: 3; NAYS: 7.

Debate arose thereon.

Amendment

Nathalie Sinclair-Desgagné moved, — That the motion be amended by deleting the words “Whereas, the Alberta Energy Regulator failed to contain a tailing pond seepage while waiting 7 months for a geochemistry study to be completed. Whereas, the Alberta Energy Regulator previously claimed that there was no contaminants found in the waterways when in fact Imperial staff told ACFN inspectors that dissolved iron was found in waterbody 3, and on April 3, 2023 that a test showed F2 hydrocarbons and naphthenic acids in waterbody.”, and deleting subparagraphs 1 to 4.

Debate arose thereon.

Subamendment

Blake Desjarlais moved, — That the amendment be amended by adding, after the words “in protecting the health and safety of Indigenous communities at risk, the committee”, the following: “1. Call on the Alberta Energy Regulator to require operators of tailing ponds to halt the release of tailings into waterways; 2. Call on the Auditor General to assess the Treaty, Inherent, and S.35 Rights impact of First Nations and Metis Communites by the Alberta Energy Regulator as it relates to Canada’s obligations to Treaty and Inherent rights of First Nations and Metis Communities in Alberta; and 3.”.

Debate arose thereon.

At 2:03 p.m., the committee adjourned to the call of the Chair.



Cédric Taquet
Clerk of the committee