FOPO Committee Meeting

37th PARLIAMENT, 2nd SESSION

Standing Committee on Fisheries and Oceans

EVIDENCE

CONTENTS

Thursday, November 7, 2002

Á

1130

The Chair (Mr. Tom Wappel (Scarborough Southwest, Lib.))

Â

1200

Mr. John Cummins (Delta—South Richmond, Canadian Alliance)

The Chair

Â

1205

Mr. John Cummins

The Chair

Mr. Georges Farrah (Bonaventure—Gaspé—Îles-de-la-Madeleine—Pabok, Lib.)

Â

1210

The Chair

Mr. Jean-Yves Roy (Matapédia—Matane, BQ)

The Chair

Mr. Jean-Yves Roy

The Chair

Mr. John Cummins

The Chair

Mr. Rodger Cuzner (Bras d'Or—Cape Breton, Lib.)

The Chair

Mr. John Cummins

Â

1215

The Chair

Mr. Georges Farrah

Mr. John Cummins

Mr. Georges Farrah

Mr. John Cummins

Mr. Georges Farrah

The Chair

Mr. Georges Farrah

The Chair

Mr. John Cummins

The Chair

Mr. Jean-Yves Roy

The Chair

Mr. Georges Farrah

The Chair

Mr. Jean-Yves Roy

The Chair

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CANADA

Standing Committee on Fisheries and Oceans

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NUMBER 002

l

2nd SESSION

l

37th PARLIAMENT

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EVIDENCE

Thursday, November 7, 2002

[Recorded by Electronic Apparatus]

Á  (1130)  

[English]

    The Chair (Mr. Tom Wappel (Scarborough Southwest, Lib.)): I call the meeting to order. We're on the record. Thank you, colleagues.

    Just to summarize, while we were waiting for quorum we had an informal discussion on a number of items. We will proceed through the routine motions and discuss them if necessary. Then we will go through the suggested topics for our committee and come up with three or four in some sort of order, so that we can get a work plan going for the next four weeks.

    I'm going to move through the motions rather quickly, colleagues. Let's do them.

    An hon. member: Do them in a block.

    The Chair: Okay.

    If there's consensus we can move through them in block. We have 12 motions before us. Would someone like to move all 12 motions?

    Moved by Mr. Matthews. Seconded by Mr. Cummins.

    (Motions agreed to [See Minutes of Proceedings])

    The Chair: All right. We've identified at least 15 items for discussion.

    Let's deal with the official request from Mr. Hearn asking that the minister appear with respect to the estimates. Would someone like to move that the committee ask the minister to appear?

    Moved by Mr. Cuzner, seconded by Mr. Roy.

    (Motion agreed to)

    The Chair: The clerk will ask the minister to appear.

    We'll move on, then, to the other items.

  (1200)  

    Mr. John Cummins (Delta—South Richmond, Canadian Alliance): I move that the chairman just read into the record the items that were discussed, so that they're on the record.

    The Chair: All right. We've discussed the following items: consideration of a draft report on aquaculture;

[Translation]

    Canadian Coast Guard, Marine Communications and Traffic Services;

[English]

the government's response to the report on foreign overfishing on the nose and tail of the Grand Banks and the Flemish Cap;

[Translation]

    Supplementary Estimates A;

[English]

the Fraser River fishery;

[Translation]

    DFO licensing policies;

[English]

munitions and offshore dumping;

[Translation]

    Cap Rouge II incident;

[English]

oil and gas exploration;

[Translation]

    Invasive species in the Great Lakes fishery;

[English]

habitat management; seals and their impact on the fisheries; fee structure and the impact of fees being levied by the coast guard; the possible groundfish catastrophe with the possible moratorium in eastern Canada; the Atlantic fisheries policy review; and the inconsistent removal—or apparently inconsistent removal—of navigational aids on the east coast.

    Have I missed anything, colleagues? I think that's all of them.

    We've already passed the motion with respect to the estimates. What should our next item of business be?

    I just want to remind you about the report on aquaculture. We've really worked on that for a long time. The former chair commissioned our researchers to get a report done. It's done and in translation. Perhaps we should take a look at it as an urgent item of business, so that we can get it off our table before we start on something new. Would that be okay?

    An hon. member: Absolutely.

  (1205)  

    Mr. John Cummins: I move that you bring it forward to the committee as soon as it has been translated, so that the committee can look at it. I would also ask if it could be supplied to committee members before the committee meets, so that we'll have a chance to review it before we get here.

    The Chair: All right. Seconded by Mr. Matthews.

    (Motion agreed to)

    The Chair: That's item two.

    Could I suggest that we try to finish the report that we're going to prepare on the Canadian coast guard MCTS traffic services on the west and east coasts, and the coast guard, as the next item. If we can get that done, the minister will hopefully have some ammunition to go to the Minister of Finance with, before the budget. So that would be item three.

    Who would move that? Moved by Mr. Cummins and seconded by Mr. Matthews.

    (Motion agreed to)

    The Chair: All right. Where do we go from here? I think we should perhaps do only one more, because we only have 16 hours.

    Monsieur Farrah.

[Translation]

    Mr. Georges Farrah (Bonaventure—Gaspé—Îles-de-la-Madeleine—Pabok, Lib.): Mr. Chairman, regarding Mr. Roy's motion about the Atlantic groundfish situation, I believe we've already discussed this point and I too wanted to suggest that the committee focus on this topic. I just want to re-emphasize that people in Atlantic Canada are greatly concerned about the groundfish situation, in light of the possible moratorium on fishing. The situation is urgent because clearly, very important decisions will need to be made in the very short term. Therefore, to my mind, given the potential impact of such a decision, it's extremely important that the committee give this matter priority consideration, examine possible scenarios so that if a moratorium is called, or if quotas are reduced significantly, it can look at ways of minimizing the adverse effect on various communities. A moratorium will affect processing plant workers, fishers and all communities. Therefore, I feel this is an extremely important topic. We've just received data on groundfish stocks and I think the committee should give this matter priority consideration.

    Thank you.

  (1210)  

[English]

    The Chair: All right. Monsieur Roy, do you want to move the motion?

[Translation]

    Mr. Jean-Yves Roy (Matapédia—Matane, BQ): Yes.

[English]

    The Chair: Monsieur Farrah, you can second. Is there any discussion?

    Oui, Monsieur Roy.

[Translation]

    Mr. Jean-Yves Roy: In any event, I'll broach the subject again when... Fine. Thank you.

[English]

    The Chair: All right. Well, we're in discussion. The idea would be that this would be next of the priority items. Everybody's agreed on that?

    (Motion agreed to)

    The Chair: So that's item four.

    We're also going to be forced to deal with item three, which I read out, about the government's response to the overfishing. The government is going to respond, and then we'll be looked to as a committee to respond to that response, presumably. I think we have virtually no choice but to assume that this will have to be on our agenda within the next four weeks. If we could make that item five, let's say, then, depending on what the government's response is, we'll have to play it out.

    Does everybody agree with what I've just said, that item five will be the government's response and our response to the government's response?

    (Motion agreed to)

    The Chair: Next item, Mr. Cummins.

    Mr. John Cummins: There are two issues. One is that we did hearings on the Fraser River last year on a couple of occasions, maybe three. I think some response from the committee is anticipated on that. It's one item we may not get to before Christmas, but I think it should be a priority item.

    The other item is this: it's my understanding that Mr. Wing, who's the head of the Union of Canadian Transportation Employees, which is I believe the union representing the coast guard, was requesting to appear before the committee with regard to the Cap Rouge II incident. Is that correct? Have you received any correspondence on that?

    The Chair: The clerk tells me that we did receive a letter and that it was circulated. Certainly, I haven't seen it; I'll have to check into that.

    Mr. Cuzner.

    Mr. Rodger Cuzner (Bras d'Or—Cape Breton, Lib.): This is in regard to the Fraser River study. Was there not a concern when we finished up last session that there may have been an imbalance in those presenting testimony on that particular study, and was it not the consensus at the time that we would seek additional witnesses on that study? I'm asking for clarification on this before taking up the matter.

    The Chair: I'll tell you what, if the committee is comfortable with this, perhaps we can get our researcher to review his notes--

    Mr. Roger Cuzner: Yes.

    The Chair: --of those meetings and put his head together with those of us who were there. And perhaps the subcommittee, in its next meeting when it's trying to prioritize the work of the committee after these five items that we've decided, could discuss that issue and then bring back some suggestions to the full committee as to where we put it in the list of priorities. It's a shame to start something new if we haven't finished what we've already worked on, but we have no choice but to do that in some cases. And you're right, there might have been some perceived imbalance and we may have to correct that.

    We have five items for the next four weeks, and it's probable that we are not likely going to be able to get beyond that. Could I suggest that the remaining items be left to the subcommittee to come back with a recommendation as to the prioritizing of those remaining items, given the comments that have been made, and we'll talk about that either on the first Tuesday or the first Thursday when we return? Would that seem reasonable?

    Mr. John Cummins: I would just say that you'll have to respond to Mr. Wing's letter--

    The Chair: Yes.

    Mr. John Cummins: --and you may want to respond positively that the committee would be prepared to hear them. And I think, given the seriousness of the situation, it might be advisable if we did in fact try to hear him as soon as possible. So you might want to--

  (1215)  

    The Chair: I'd want to review the letter--

    Mr. John Cummins: Yes.

    The Chair: --and I'm sure other members would want to review the letter and I think we'd want to talk about it in subcommittee and get a consensus so that we can make a recommendation. Obviously the usual pattern that I can recall in this committee is that people who want to appear before us are generally heard either in an open committee or certainly in some sort of forum if their issue is relevant to the fisheries or oceans.

    Mr. Georges Farrah: It's about the coast guard, right?

    Mr. John Cummins: Yes.

    Mr. Georges Farrah: It's about the Cap Rouge, right?

    Mr. John Cummins: Yes.

[Translation]

    Mr. Georges Farrah: Mr. Chairman, my only concern is that if we go along with this request, we'll have to ensure that we have enough time to hear from Coast Guard officials.

[English]

    The Chair: Of course.

[Translation]

    Mr. Georges Farrah: I'm not interested in hearing only one side of the story. Do you understand what I'm saying? If we have time for only one side, that's not going to help the committee. Therefore, if we're going to go ahead with this, I'd also like to hear the officials' response to the brief submitted or to the discussions.

    The Chair: You're absolutely right.

[English]

    Mr. John Cummins: If we did hear Mr. Wing and his group before Christmas, it would just be for information, and I wouldn't expect the committee would comment on it until they had heard from everybody. And I quite agree with my friend.

    The Chair: Right. Mr. Cummins, if you just leave it to the steering committee, of which you're a member, then we could perhaps deal with it in that way.

    Mr. John Cummins: Yes.

    The Chair: Is there anything else that we need to discuss today, other than what we've already gone through?

    Oui, monsieur.

[Translation]

    Mr. Jean-Yves Roy: With respect to DFO licensing policies, I can't say that this will be a priority before next spring. Perhaps we could focus on the subject after the holidays.

    I was looking at the list of suggested topics, among others at the item Habitat Management and the following question came to mind: what is our take on habitat management? Basically, when we talk about oil and gas exploration, we also have to consider offshore dumping of hazardous materials. This also comes under habitat management, because the practice of dumping hazardous materials is not habitat friendly. There are limits, after all.

[English]

    The Chair: Yes, Mr. Farrah.

[Translation]

    Mr. Georges Farrah: The important thing at this time is to identify items to which the committee should give priority consideration before Christmas and to ensure that we can address all of them. Then, perhaps even in December, we can plan an agenda for future meetings and add new items to the list at that time. However, at some point, we need to focus on specific topics so that we can conclude our work. Given the narrow window of opportunity we have, I think this is what's important. We have to be able to finish whatever we start.

[English]

    The Chair: Oui, absolument.

    Mr. Roy, just for your information, we did receive from our clerk and our researcher some suggested topics. One of them was habitat management, and it was discussed. And you're right, that is as wide as we want to make it, really.

    Any other comments?

[Translation]

    Mr. Jean-Yves Roy: To add to what Georges was saying, on the subject of habitat management, I still think this item is not urgent and could be deferred. The same holds true for DFO licensing policies. We could examine these policies after the holidays. It isn't a priority for this fall.

[English]

    The Chair: Excellent. If there's nothing else, then, enjoy your weekend in the constituency. We'll see you on Tuesday at 11 o'clock, after the break.

    This meeting is adjourned.